McGuinty dodges GSA question
ONTARIO NEWS / All student supports must go through 'Catholic lens': board chair
Andrea Houston / Toronto / Monday, March 21, 2011
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UPDATE - March 22 at 2:20pm - After repeated calls by Xtra for comment, Egale Canada releases a statement stating that "privacy rules" prevent the organization from revealing any information about student clubs, even saying whether or not GSAs exist.

"It is out of respect for the privacy and confidentiality of these individuals, and an appreciation for the sensitivity of the issues and circumstance involved, that Egale maintains a strict adherence to this policy," Egale states. "Under no circumstances will Egale identify or speak publicly about individuals, clubs or schools that have chosen not to do so themselves."

Since February Egale's Helen Kennedy has gone on record with Xtra and MPP Glen Murray, assuring that there are GSAs at "some" Catholic schools yet refusing to reveal which ones. At no time did Xtra ask for names of students.


UPDATE - March 22 - Liberal MPP Glen Murray spoke to Xtra at Queen's Park, but said only that his government is looking into the matter. "The equity policy is pretty clear. It gives students rights to form groups... The premier is restating what the government policy is. We're working very hard with the students and the groups to make sure they can get their full rights."

Later in the evening, Murray posted a message on his Facebook page dubbed "Time to pull together for safe and inclusive schools." In the note Murray calls himself a Christian and says, "There are Catholic schools that have GSAs, and Egale is doing great work on this issue with many caring leaders in the Catholic school system. I have met with school trustees and representatives of Catholic teachers. There are many who support inclusive schools and GSAs."

March 21: Students in Mississauga will likely be disappointed by Premier Dalton McGuinty's response when he was asked why his government is refusing to enforce its own equity policy and thereby allow gay-straight alliances (GSA) in Ontario Catholic schools.

The question came from NDP MPP Rosario Marchese in question period at Queen’s Park on March 21. He told McGuinty that gay, lesbian and trans students frequently experience abuse at school. “The ministry of education policy states that all Ontario schools must offer full support to students, such as through a gay-straight alliance. Why is the government refusing to enforce its own policy?”
Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty
(Andrea Houston)


But McGuinty dodged the question. He says all schools boards are getting the message “loud and clear” that they must adhere to the equity and inclusive education policy, but Catholic boards are free to find an alternative to GSAs.

“We are making it perfectly clear to all our school boards, all our schools, all our principals, all our teachers and all our students that it is unacceptable to discriminate on the basis of race, gender, religion and sexual orientation,” but, McGuinty adds, “boards can find different ways to ensure they can adhere to those policies.”

Education Minister Leona Dombrowsky was not in the legislature to hear the question. Immediately following a tweet announcing her absence, her office emailed Xtra, saying the minister “had planned personal time” and would return to work on Wednesday. She also refused a phone interview. The refusal makes it 76 days and counting that Dombrowsky has remained silent since the GSA ban at the Halton Catholic District School Board (HCDSB) surfaced in January.

When questioned, HCDSB board chair Alice Anne LeMay told Xtra the board “doesn’t allow Nazi groups either. Gay-straight alliances are banned because they are not within the teachings of the Catholic Church.” In the face of national outrage, the HCDSB lifted the ban on GSAs, but it still does not allow any student group with the word gay in its title.

Then, on March 16, Xtra told the story of a group of 32 students at St Joseph’s Catholic Secondary School in Mississauga who were blocked when they asked to start a GSA.

The group’s founder, Leanne Iskander, 16, set up a public Facebook group and has since mobilized the support of human rights and queer activists, lawyers, university professors, journalists and local community groups -- 111 supporters and counting.

Iskander says she’s taking all the attention in stride. “School was okay today,” she tells Xtra. “Lots of the teachers were talking about the GSA, but nothing was said to me.”
From left: Taechun Menns, 16, Leanne Iskander, 16, are trying to start a gay-straight alliance at St Joseph's Catholic Secondary School in Mississauga.
(Andrea Houston)


After question period Marchese expressed disappointment with McGuinty’s answer. He said the students should be allowed to start a GSA and call it a GSA.

“He avoided the question. Both the primary and the supplementary one,” Marchese says. “His answer simply referred to the policy, which I agree with, but it is not being enforced. I think it’s to their detriment. I don’t know why they aren’t helping the school do the right thing.

“[The students in Mississauga] will be disappointed. That’s why we have to continue to press the premier and the minister to do the right thing.”

But those in a position to “do the right thing” today are not talking either. St Joe’s principal Frances Jacques wouldn’t take Xtra’s call March 21.

Dufferin-Peel Catholic District School Board chair Anna Abbruscato asked why the club can’t be called a different name. “I have to look into whether a gay-straight alliance is in compliance with what we believe. Everything has to go through a Catholic lens.”
Ontario NDP education critic Rosario Marchese
(Andrea Houston)


Abbruscato says there are already supports in place at the school. One of those “Catholic supports” is Courage International, which “ministers to those with same-sex attractions" and counsels gay people “to abstain from acting on their sexual desires and to live chastely according to the Catholic Church's teachings.”

Courage International also uses the 12-step program developed by Alcoholics Anonymous to try to “cure” gays.

“I don’t agree with that,” she says. “I can’t believe that. [Gay] is not a disease. Curing gay tendencies is ridiculous.” Abbruscato promised to “look into” getting the pamphlets out of the guidance office.

Abbruscato was shocked to hear about the Pastoral Guidelines to Assist Students of Same-Sex Orientation, found in all Ontario Catholic schools. The document is the primary reference material for instructing school administrators and teachers on homosexuality. It reads that "gay" is not an identity, gay sex is “immoral” and gay people ought to live a life of “chastity.”

“[Gay people] must live a life of chastity, yes, that’s what our religion says,” she says. “I believe we are counselling gay students appropriately. We support all students no matter what their tendencies are.”

Casey Oraa, Queer Ontario’s political action committee chair, says the language used by board officials and the messages given to students in Catholic schools is discriminatory and anti-gay.

“That sort of language is not something that should be used in any public school,” he says. “These are outdated notions of queer sexuality that’s still used by rightwing religious communities. It’s heteronormative language.”

Oraa was quick to point out Ontario’s Catholic schools are publicly funded and must adhere to ministry guidelines on equity, and he also recommends the ministry launch an investigation into the anti-gay messages in Catholic schools.

“Accepting a general equity group is feeding into the myth,” he says. “The Pastoral Guidelines are unhealthy and anti-queer. It is forcing kids to internalize shame. You can’t legitimize a general equity group. You have to fight that tooth and nail.”

Noa Mendelsohn Aviv, director of equity for the Canadian Civil Liberties Association, agrees. She says denying the students a GSA violates their constitutional rights, such as freedom of expression, freedom of association and the fundamental right to equality.

Queer Ontario is hosting a public education forum on the International Day of Pink, April 13, at Jarvis Collegiate Secondary School to discuss the benefits of an updated sex education curriculum and GSAs.

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Reader Comments


 
Is there a nproblem?
Natalie Rizzo, the Toronto Catholic board’s student trustee, said teens in some board schools have asked for GSAs, “and while they haven’t been denied, the groups tend to go by different names — they could be the equity club or a diversity group or a rainbow group or something like that,” she said, but function in the same way as a GSA. Does any know if these alternative groups do exist? If so, why push for a group called Gay Straight Alliance?
michel, Toronto ON
03/22/11 2:21 AM EST
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No, 'The Club Formerly Known as a GSA' is not OK
The message McGuinty wanted to communicate yesterday is that the Equity policy must be implemented in ALL school boards. But the message that was actually communicated: McGuinty is perfectly OK with publicly funded Catholic boards keeping their gay students and teachers firmly closeted. "Don't ask, don't tell". Here's another big part of the message: Dombrosky's convenient absence means that she is afraid of this issue. The bottom line is that McGuinty avoided the real issue, and that he is OK placing Church doctrine ahead of the well-being of Ontario students. THAT is the leader of the "liberal" party of Ontario in 2011. What a joke.
George, Toronto Ontario
03/22/11 6:21 AM EST
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Unacceptable to discriminate on religious grounds?
McGuinty: "We are making it perfectly clear to all our school boards, all our schools, all our principals, all our teachers and all our students that it is unacceptable to discriminate on the basis of race, gender, religion and sexual orientation," Really? It is no longer acceptable to discriminate based on religion? Then why is there still a Catholic board at all? No other faith has public funding for their religious schools. Why do only Catholic parents have choice? All or none, Mr. McGuinty. All or none.
Leonard Baak, Ottawa Ontario
03/22/11 6:37 AM EST
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145
Ontario Ministry of Education Policy/Program Memorandum 145, still in effect, states in part "Boards must also help school staff to give support to students who wish to participate in gay-straight alliances...". It seems very straightforward that the publicly-funded Catholic schools are not exempt from this.
Randy, Windsor ON
03/22/11 6:41 AM EST
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Amend the Constitution
It is a sad reality that the publicly Catholic school system in Ontario is exempted from the Ontario Human Rights Code. The way to change that is for the legislature of Ontario to finally act to amend the Constitution to end the outdated section that permits this. The courts can't do anything to uphold human rights in catholic schools until the government changes the Constitution. There have been 10 similar constitutional amendments made since the Constitution Act of 1982 introduced a simple bilateral agreement mechanism for amending sections that only affect one province -- and six of those have related to religious education 'rights' in other provinces.
Rick, Ottawa ON
03/22/11 7:03 AM EST
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A Billion dollars a year for THIS?
Is there any issue in Ontario today that is more more pressing than this? We have a duplicate and discriminatory Catholic school system that believes itself to be above the law--and apparently is. The "duplicate" part means Ontario taxpayers pay about 1 Billion dollars each year (i.e. over and above what a unified and truly public system would cost) for a parallel separate school system. The discriminatory part means that Catholic schools are currently allowed to discriminate against gays and non-Catholics, which has earned us two condemnations from the UN Human Rights Committee. A simple Constitutional amendment would remove the Bishops' stranglehold over public education AND save taxpayers a billion dollars a year. Yet McGuinty isn't interested. Is he concerned over what the Bishops will do to his Catholic eternal soul? Time to enter the 21st century. We're allowed to use the "g" word now.
Samantha, Toronto ON
03/22/11 7:36 AM EST
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why push for a group called Gay Straight Alliance?
michel: "Does any know if these alternative groups do exist? If so, why push for a group called Gay Straight Alliance?" Having an 'equity' club is all fair and nice, but keeps pushing queer visibility back in the closet. Having an 'equity' club allows the Catholic Church to further their agenda that the 'homosexual lifestyle' doesn't exist. Being counseled by pastors and chaplains well versed in Catholic doctrine does nothing to support our gay youth aside from making them more confused then they already are. In the end it comes down to the youth, and what they want to call it, and they should be allowed to call it whatever they want, including a GSA. Perhaps it's because the Catholic faith doesn't "believe" that a person can be gay, and therefore goes against their religion, so they're allowed to get away with not using Gay in Gay Straight Alliance. Fair enough, I wouldn't want someone to force me to do something that was against my religion or beliefs, however I'm also not receiving public money to fund a public school, that's passively (and in my opinion very actively) being openly homophobic. It's 2011, it's time to start separating Church and State.
JM, Toronto Ontario
03/22/11 9:25 AM EST
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McGuinty misses an historic oppourutnity
McGuinty speaks out of both sides of his mouth on this one. He has a real chance here to compel the Catholics to abandon their bigoted approach to homosexuals but fails to deliver. One day people will look back on this time in much the same way as we now do the civil rights movement for Blacks in the 1960's. This type of discrimination is what will (sadly) do in the Catholic school system.
chris, timmins on
03/22/11 9:47 AM EST
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McGuinty - A snake from Ireland?
The Catholic church keeps doing it again.It is filled with pedophiles and others that were never identified as pedophiles. My priest was dragged out of a Richmond Ontario church for this. They discriminate against school kids but demand that their schools recieve public money as they don't want to be tarnished by attending public chools. McGuinty is a catholic so he is slithering away again on the issue. Thanks for the big $400K. Its nice to get our own money back.
Bryan Charlebois, Toonto Ontario
03/22/11 10:05 AM EST
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Still nothing from Glen Murray, eh?
Glen went from talking tough to promising an interview some time in the future to dead silence. Looks like Liberal party machinery has crushed whatever dissent he thought he could muster. Next. Does anyone know who the Green Party candidate is in Murray's riding of Toronto Centre? S/he should get our full support. Only the Greens (and Rosario Marchese) seem to have the guts to speak up on this issue.
Frank, Toronto ON
03/22/11 10:52 AM EST
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Freedom of religion in Canada
Freedom of religion in Canada is a constitutionally protected right. The constitutionally provided mandate of Halton separate (Catholic) schools is to provide education in a school setting that is reflective of Roman Catholic theology, doctrine, and practices. This mandate can manifest itself in the Program of Studies and the curriculum, exercises and practices, and staffing. The limits of this mandate are determined by the application of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms, and judicial decisions. The Charter does not prohibit discrimination by churches, associations and businesses. Section 2 of the Charter protects freedom of religion and section 93 of the Constitution recognizes the right to denominational schools.
Vox Populi Z, Sydney Nova Scotia
03/22/11 10:59 AM EST
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The thin edge of the wedge
Homosexual–straight alliances are student organizations that are intended to provide a safe and supportive environment for homosexual, bi-sexual, and transgender youth and their straight allies. While all parents agree that all forms of schoolyard harassment should be discouraged, they charge that liberals and homosexual rights groups are using the anti-bullying banner to advance a hidden “homosexual agenda,” implicitly endorsing and affirming, for example, same-sex marriage.
Vox Populi Z, Sydney Nova Scotia
03/22/11 11:14 AM EST
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The strategy
Since the early 1990s gay activists and various homosexual groups have been using strategies that provide them with greater access to public schools. Usually the focus is upon making the schools a safer place for homosexual, bisexual, transgender, and transsexual students, thereby justifying the introduction of topics and speakers on the subject of homosexuality. The establishment of homosexual clubs on campus provides an ongoing forum to promote and advance homosexuality to students on campus. For example, movie nights showcasing homosexual relationships; pro-homosexual day of silence events; same-sex handholding days; hosting pro-homosexual speaker events; and publishing pro-homosexual articles in school newspapers.
Vox Populi Z, Sydney Nova Scotia
03/22/11 11:15 AM EST
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Catholics will provide for their students.
The debate surrounding Homosexual/Straight Alliances (GSAs) in Catholic high schools is being complicated by the fact that people are not distinguishing between an objective and a strategy. GSAs are a strategy that some people propose to achieve an objective with which the Bishops of Ontario are in agreement: that all students in schools feel safe and respected. The Catholic objective is that each student be treated with dignity, for each is a child of God. It is not right or fair to suggest that one particular strategy is the only way to achieve a given goal. Catholics seek to achieve the goal of a safe and loving environment for all students in a way that is in harmony with their Christian faith.
Vox Populi Z, Sydney Nova Scotia
03/22/11 11:16 AM EST
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re: Freedom of religion in Canada
Vox Populi Z your post reminded me so much of this article I had to include a link to it here http://www.theonion.com/articles/area-man-passionate-defender-of-what-he-imagines-c,2849/ Contrary to your claims the Charter does prohibit discrimination by churches, outside of their church, as well as prohibiting discrimination by "associations and businesses". You are just so plainly wrong I don't know how else to say it. As well the right to Catholic schools can easily be removed, if there's the political will to do so, as we've seen in other provinces who have gotten rid of their catholic schools.
Rich, Toronto Ontario
03/22/11 12:38 PM EST
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re: The thin edge of the wedge
Again Vox Populi Z you're way off on this one too. There's no need for GSAs to act as the thin edge of the wedge in endorsing same sex marriage since same sex marriage is already legal all across Canada. Have you not read any newspapers in the last ten years or so? That's how long same sex marriage has been legal in Ontario at least. No GSAs are only about respecting the rights, dignity and safety of LGBT students in a high school setting.
Rich, Toronto Ontario
03/22/11 12:44 PM EST
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re: The strategy and Catholics will provide for th
Vox Populi Z I agree completely with your the strategy post, though its said a little awkwardly, yes the point of GSAs are to make "the schools a safer place for homosexual, bisexual, transgender, and transsexual students" and you've correctly identified some of the ways its done, good for you. s for your other post do you really believe "the Bishops of Ontario are in agreement: that all students in schools feel safe and respected. The Catholic objective is that each student be treated with dignity, for each is a child of God. It is not right or fair to suggest that one particular strategy is the only way to achieve a given goal"? Because they have a strange way of showing LGBT students how "respected" they are nor are they doing anything to make them feel safe by banning clubs that re designed to protect them and as for dignity, how is it the catholic schools are treating their LGBT students with dignity by denying who they are and preventing them from taking measures that would make them feel better about themselves and their own safety at school? There is nothing dignified about forcing LGBT students into the closet like the catholic schools do. You also say its not right that only one strategy is seen as the correct way to achieve a given goal yet the catholic schools are insisting on just that, just one strategy, theirs, of keeping LGBT students in the closet so they don't have to have any actual humans in mind when condemning LGBT people for being LGBT people. Vox Populi Z your series of posts comes across almost as satire except that I think its pretty clear you're actually serious about what you say. Just goes to show how ridiculous the Catholic view of LGBT people really is.
Rich, Toronto Ontario
03/22/11 1:00 PM EST
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Are we really having this discussion
Wow, its 2011 and we are having this kind of discussion. What a world to live in. You have the province of Ontario allowing 40 percent of its publicly funded schools to discriminate against its STUDENTS and teachers. The province has a policy but won't enforce it. The reality is that the law allows the Catholic Boards to even discriminate in hiring. If you are a Catholic teacher graduate from a Faculty of Education, you can apply for a teaching position in both the public and Catholic Boards. If you are a non Catholic teacher looking for a job, you are limited to apply for a teaching position only to the public Boards. How can public money allow this type of discrimination to exist in 2011? What amazes me is that the NDP doesn't wake up to the fact that if they came out in favour of a single system, they would win the next election. I can't believe that the Archdiocese of Toronto endorses some wacko group that proposes a 12 step program to cure one of their "gayness". I think that the Archdiocese and many of his priests should try the 12 step process to see if they can be cured of their "gayness" or perhaps they have already gone through the 12 step process and been "cured". Amazing that any government would want to get in bed with these "nuts". As to the question of a Constitutional right to discriminate, all it would take to eliminate the "right" to discriminate is a Bill passed by the Ontario Legislature ending the right to discriminate and Ottawa would alter the constitution. Has happened in Newfoundland and Quebec. They no longer have publicly funded denominational systems.
George, Toronto On
03/22/11 1:04 PM EST
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Imbibing a few too many Tom Collins cocktails
Not only is Vox Populi Z wrong on so many counts, but he is also a plagiarist. His comments about strategy etc. are actually the words of Tom Collins, Archbishop of Toronto who signed a January 14, 2011 statement from the assembly of Catholic Bishops of Ontario that tackles the GSA issue. Maybe he's had a few too many Tom Collins cocktails. His comments should not be reported to the moderator because people need to see what we're up against.
Tonya Callaghan, Calgary Alberta
03/22/11 2:00 PM EST
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...
The same Premier who was perfectly willing to shit on other religions to get re-elected in 2007, is now coming to the defense of his own. Mcguinty, we voted in 2007 to deny all faith based funding including the current Catholic system. Do your fucking job.
Andrew McInally, Mississauga Ontario
03/22/11 2:27 PM EST
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Re: ...
Andrew, the 2007 election was not at all about stripping Catholic schools of public funding. That was never proposed by any party. It's an issue nobody wants to touch since Catholics are a majority in Ontario. Just because McGuinty, a Catholic Premier, won't roll back a 150 year old policy (funding Catholic schools), doesn't mean his faith is getting in the way of his governing. Ontario needs a referendum on this issue because any governing party has a mandate to take action. I applaud the Premier for his strong statement opposing discrimination in schools. You want to blame someone, blame the parents who continue to send their kids to these places.
Ryan, Toronto ON
03/22/11 5:33 PM EST
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Feel free to print and post this EVERYWHERE
This is the cover of a recent issue of the Ontario College of Teachers magazine "Professionally Speaking": http://i.imgur.com/kWeJz.jpg I've corrected the cover so that it more accurately reflects Ontario's reality: http://i.imgur.com/7RzT2.jpg
Rick, Ottawa ON
03/22/11 8:40 PM EST
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Murray is happily complicit in the Big Lie
Once again Glen Murray insists that GSAs really do exist in some Catholic schools, but the details are top secret. We mustn't know which schools, because we're so concerned for the safety of the students. Yet Church officials tell us there can never be any GSAs in any Catholic school ever. Both statements can't be correct. So someone must be lying. Mr. Murray, are you calling the Bishops liars? Or perhaps you are using the term "GSA" in a very loose--and very weasely--way? In either case, your lack of integrity will cost you in the next election, though clearly you appear to have calculated otherwise.
Robert, Toronto ON
03/23/11 10:39 PM EST
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Vatican Slams Gay Rights at U.N.
Meanwhile, the Vatican has slammed gay rights at the United Nations. See: http://www.advocate.com/News/Daily_News/2011/03/23/Vatican_Slams_Gay_Rights_at_UN/
Randy, Toronto Ontario
03/23/11 11:32 PM EST
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Percentage of Catholics in Ontario
According to this 2001 (couldn't find anymore recent stats) only 35% (I realize that the figure has probably increased or decreased, but I'm hesitant to believe it's jumped up to 50%) of the Ontario population is made up of Catholics. So why are we catering to this minority that obviously thinks it can bypass the law?
JM, Tornto Ontario
03/24/11 4:01 PM EST
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I love Glenn
@Robert Glenn Murray is the most ethical, responsive, rooted in the community queer politician I have ever had the pleasure of working with. There were Catholic GSAs at the Egale breakfast so many people are left with the impression there are GSAs in Catholic schools. Liar indeed! Why is our community so mean?!
Really, Toronto ON
03/24/11 7:58 PM EST
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Catholic Schools
I'm a student at a catholic high school and the entire student body isn't catholic, some people that have commented on here claim that catholic schools discriminate against non-catholics and that's just simply wrong, most of the people that go to my high school aren't catholic, (they're some other denomination of christianity or an atheist etc.). As far as the discrimination against gays goes, if you were to say something degrading about a gay person you'd be severely punished, probably by being suspended, so putting down gays isn't accepted at the high school I go to anyways (i'd imagine it'd be the same in others since they all preach that everyones equal in gods eyes). Next, my parents sent me to catholic school, and they pay taxes for me to be in school, so it's not as if we're getting a free ride here. On the topic of getting a GSA at the school, if there's enough interest for one then there probably should be one, if you call it a different name but it keeps people comfortable with who they are then that shouldn't really matter. and on the topic of shutting down catholic schools, if they're a demand for them then why shut them down ? plus it's mandatory to take a world religions course in grade 11 so that breaks down barriers, it doesn't build them
Brett, Owen Sound Ontario
04/14/11 6:27 PM EST
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