Halton Catholic schools ban gay-straight alliance groups
NEWS / 'We don't have Nazi groups either': board chair
Andrea Houston / Toronto / Thursday, January 06, 2011
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UPDATE JAN 16: Gay students feel betrayed by Halton Catholic board
UPDATE JAN 10: Xtra story on Halton Catholic GSA ban sparks outrage
UPDATE JAN 12: Halton students may launch human rights challenge

JAN 6: With the world’s spotlight on the It Gets Better campaign and gay teen suicides, the urgency for schools to create gay-straight alliance (GSA) groups seems obvious.

But while the Ontario Ministry of Education thinks GSAs are important, the Halton Catholic District School Board (HCDSB) takes a different view.
The HCDSB feels the groups are harmful and has issued a ban on GSAs altogether.

“We don’t have Nazi groups either,” rationalizes board chair Alice Anne LeMay. “Gay-straight alliances are banned because they are not within the teachings of the Catholic Church.”
Halton Catholic District School Board (HCDSB) chair Alice Anne LeMay.
(From the HCDSB website)


“If a gay student requests a gay-straight alliance they would be denied,” she says flatly. “It’s not in accordance with the teachings of the church. If they wanted to have a club outside of school, fine, just not in school.”

As of 2011, all Ontario school boards have equity and inclusive education policies that help schools provide safe and positive environments for students of all races, religions and sexual orientations. The policies, which encourage GSAs, give schools the tools to deal with discrimination.

“Schools that have GSAs are a lot more open, caring, welcoming and a whole lot safer,” says Helen Kennedy, executive director of Egale Canada, who has been involved in the fight against homophobia and transphobia in schools for the past two years. She is quick to point out that many other Catholic schools in Ontario have GSA groups.

Michael Pautler is the education director of the HCDSB, a board responsible for 40 elementary schools and eight secondary schools, a total of about 29,000 students. He tries to explain the ban to Xtra, saying the amendment was made to the equity and inclusive education policy after one trustee took issue with the language before the policy was approved in November.

“Anybody can have input into the process as the policy is being developed, but ultimately the language at the end of the process is approved collectively,” he says.

Pautler justifies the decision by saying the ministry’s equity and inclusive education policy only proposes GSAs as “one possibility” to fight homophobia.

Although he wouldn’t provide another possibility, Pautler manages, “All students that attend school should be able to feel free of harassment and are protected from any forms of persecution or anything that makes them feel marginalized.”

Apparently students can create groups, just none that have the word “gay” in the title.

“Dialogue groups can achieve the same kinds of objectives, but that have a broader focus on inclusion generally,” he says. “Or a celebration of diversity, as opposed to focusing on any one particular expression of diversity.”

And that’s exactly what Pautler says he would tell a gay student asking for a GSA.

The Ministry of Education did not respond to interview requests from Xtra. Ministry spokesperson Gary Wheeler instead answered via email: “Each board implements the policy based on their own local needs and circumstances and in a way to best fit their own communities. Some boards may choose to support gay-straight alliances, others may not.”

Kennedy says the board is trying to circumvent the provincial policy by adjusting the language to suit its beliefs.

“That’s ridiculous,” she says. “That’s like saying drunk-driving laws don’t apply to everyone.”

Just as the province’s scrapped sex education curriculum was scrutinized last year by religious groups, the equity and inclusive education policy was put under a similar microscope by Catholic school boards.

The Ontario Education Services Corporation (OESC), which assists school boards in drafting policies, examines the provincial legislation “through a Catholic lens” and has posted a template on its website for Catholic boards to use when drafting the policy at the board level, Kennedy says.

The HCDSB took the ministry legislation and adapted it, she says.

“[The policy] lists gender, sexual orientation, a whole bunch of stuff, that Halton has not included in their equity and inclusive education policy,” she says. “The legislation is pretty clear.”

Board chair LeMay says Catholic schools have special rights to define religion standards.

“That’s the rights of the Catholic schools,” she says. “We have denominational rights. And our rights say we will not do anything against magisterial of the Catholic Church.”

Kennedy says Egale is watching all school boards and reading their equity policies closely.

“Because we do a lot of work with schools and GSAs, we have to deal with this far more than we’d like to,” she says. “So this is an issue that is on the horizon now, and a lot of that is to do with the focus on the It Gets Better campaign and all the teen suicides.”


Read more of Xtra's coverage on the Halton Catholic District School Board's ban:

Halton Catholic schools ban gay-straight alliance groups

Xtra story on Halton Catholic GSA ban sparks outrage

Why is Ontario funding an anti-gay school system?

Halton Catholic policy and GSA ban remains in effect

Halton Catholic students may launch human rights challenge

Catholic bishops vs. anti-discrimination policies. Who wins?



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Reader Comments


 
What Bullshit!
It is becoming increasingly clear that the catholic church still believes that it is the arbitor of morality for the entire human race. When in the name of the creator are they going to understand that their little bent on life is not the sole view of the world at large. Their little man in white and the red caped vagabonds that surround him are really bad actors on a big stage. Really...it is time to drop the curtain, change the props and mount a new production.
Visogoth, Edmonton Albertaa
01/07/11 11:45 AM EST
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Seriously?
It's ridiculous and shameful enough that this woman is deliberately persecuting and alienating LGBT youth and supporters in her school board. To have the audacity to then draw any sort of comparison to a Nazi group? She ought to be fired.
Jen, Mississauga Ontario
01/07/11 1:32 PM EST
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And yet
....it's perfectly appropriate for the gay community to compare Israel to apartheid....
Jim, Toronto Ontario
01/07/11 1:36 PM EST
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Oh, Halton Region
I went to school in Oakville, which is part of Halton. It was hard growing up gay in the PUBLIC school system, but I can't imagine how this must make queer kids in the Catholic system feel. Halton was very conservative when I was a kid and sadly not much has changed... There's a petition here in case anyone wants to sign it: http://www.change.org/petitions/view/tell_the_halton_catholic_district_school_board_to_lift_ban_on_gay-straight_alliances
Kate, Toronto Oakville
01/07/11 1:38 PM EST
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Not much of a surprise
I went to Catholic high school in Halton, and this was pretty much their policy already. I guess they just decided to make it official and broadcast the HCDSB's bigotry to the rest of the country. Yet another reason to be a proud Assumption High graduate...
Chelsey Worth, Burlington Ontario
01/07/11 1:55 PM EST
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Simple Solution
There is a simple solution to this, if they don't want GSA's then they should no longer get any public funding. Let the Catholic Church pay for it. Enough is enough it's time to get tough with these School Boards that don't want to follow the Ontario Ministry of Educations policys.
Don, Barrie Ontario
01/07/11 3:06 PM EST
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So to set things straight...
Groups designed to have people help people is a bad, but raping children is A-OK. It would almost be comical if it wasn't so atrociously sick. Shameful.
Sean, Niagara Ontario
01/07/11 3:09 PM EST
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Excuse me?
I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. The kids in the Catholic board have the sames rights as Canadians that I have in the regular school board. If there is any petition or protest, I'll sign or be there.
Reggie Bradley, Burlington Ontario
01/07/11 3:15 PM EST
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Irony: the Pope was a Nazi
The irony of course is the current Pope was a Hitler youth... And yes, Reggie, there's a petition: http://gayrights.change.org/petitions/view/tell_the_halton_catholic_district_school_board_to_lift_ban_on_gay-straight_alliances
Strepsi, Montreal QC
01/07/11 4:07 PM EST
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Who is?
Who is the Catholic church to criticise Nazis? Not to mention use their name to demonise gays. I was lucky enough to know a gay holocaust survivor (and they are quite rare, because the Nazis MURDERED so many o them). I can't imagine what it would have felt for him to hear these people try and use the word NAZI to put gays down.
Johnp, Chicago IL
01/07/11 4:24 PM EST
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Revoke public funding
If a school cannot abide by the Charter of Human Rights and Freedoms, then it should not be publicly funded and it should not be tax-exempt.
Roger C, North Cowichan BC
01/07/11 4:45 PM EST
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You know who else was a nazi...
You know who else was a Nazi? The Pope.
Robert Smith, Burlington Ontario
01/07/11 5:58 PM EST
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grandparents
A few years ago I started an argument with a friend who was VERY upset with the Catholic teachers who had come out with a statement re gay high school students. He had gleaned this info from a broadcast by a well known Ottawa radio personality. My question to him was............. " What would you think if one of your grandsons discovered he was gay and killed himself because he knew that his beloved grandfather thought that he was disgusting and evil?" he never answered this question. I guess this school board has said........ "kill yourself........ we do not care"...........
Nancy, Ingleside on
01/07/11 6:10 PM EST
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Can we finally put a stop to the public funding?
Stop public funding for two school systems!! Why oh why oh why does Canada have two school systems? How much better would our public system be if we weren't spending money on the Catholic system? Sure, both systems screw kids up, but why pay for a system that doesn't even listen to public input and would rather follow a pope (esp one that allows pedophile priests to continue abusing!!!).
me, Georgetown Ontario
01/07/11 6:15 PM EST
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Ignorant
The last thing the Catholic church should be doing is talking about Nazis when it was complicit in the Holocaust. And hello, queer people were killed in the Holocaust as well. This woman is so ignorant of history that it's astounding.
KH, Toronto Ontario
01/07/11 7:09 PM EST
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Letter to Halton District Catholic school board
Here is the text of an email that I just sent to the board (comments@hcdsb.org). I forgot to CC Xtra - me bad: I am angered at the comments recently made by A.A. Lemay of your board regarding the banning of Gay-Straight Alliances in Halton District Catholic schools. She was quoted as saying “We don’t have Nazi groups either. Gay-straight alliances are banned because they are not within the teachings of the Catholic Church.” Has she conveniently forgotten that the head of your church, Pope Maledict, was once a loyal member of the Hitler Youth? What about religious orders with members who have been convicted of child molestation? Neither the Hitler Youth movement nor the rape of innocents is within the teachings of your church. The pope should retire, and the Franciscan Order, the Jesuit Order, ad nauseam should be dissolved. ... and A.A. Lemay should resign from the board immediately. Yours in disgust, Robert Stewart
Rob Stewart, Toronto ON
01/07/11 7:12 PM EST
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Pope =/= Nazi
Read and inform yourselves before you post stupid things: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Benedict_XVI
Amanda, New Brunswick NJ
01/07/11 8:24 PM EST
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Really Amanda? A Nazi? and the United States
never helped Nazi Germany? Pope Benedict XVI did serve in the SS but he was forced to served against his will because it was required by German law and was CONSCRIPTED into the Hitler Youth (more of the Pope under Nazi Germay http://usat.ly/fQNR4Z ) . Since you are from the United States I can remember Coca Cola, IBM, George Bush's Grandfather(Prescott Bush), Ford,General Motors and all those friendly freedom loving loyal American Companies and politicians either Democratic or Republican did help Nazi Germany rise to power and in the war machine during the early years of World War Two. So what is your point? The United States help Nazi Germany in the concentration camps such as IBM's Hollerith punch card technology did help them with massicing Gays, Jews, Romas or anything the Nazi's hated. Also Wikipedia is not a source but this could help http://bit.ly/cxS5m , http://bit.ly/epMGtD, http://bit.ly/hvbOHc, http://wapo.st/fpJYsv, http://bit.ly/eVKDch,
Peter From, Toronto ON
01/07/11 8:53 PM EST
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The Catholic Church(to get back to the story)
does not have it's own problems such as Priests loving Children a little to much and they go after a Gay-Straight Alliance? Why doesn't the Catholic Church go after their members who are causing harm to Children?
Peter From, Toronto ON
01/07/11 9:00 PM EST
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My experience...
I went through the Catholic system during my elementary and secondary education. The reality is, a lot of these comments are just as misinformed as much as people claim the policy and/or Catholic schools and/or trustees and/or administrators are. It's easy to lay blame on people, but we will never come to an inclusive society if we only attack and don't try to understand each other. I am of the position that GSA alliances would be of benefit to the gay and straight Catholic student and teacher community. I also understand that the way trustees work (even in public schools) if one person has an issue, it can change an entire policy. The issue isn't exactly irrelevant either; the Catholic schools must maintain the Catholic Church's stance, which is not promoting homosexuality...whether or not any of these school administrators, trustees, myself, etc.. agree with this stance. The Catholic school system is mandated to go by the Catholic Church. In addition, the trustee being interviewed from the Halton board is in fact gay himself, yet, he can understand that there are alternatives. Furthermore, my two Catholic schools I attended were incredibly open and inclusive environments; in religion classes, we touched on these issues. The teachers are of course required to remain unbiased, but they support student opinions and guide students to be self-aware and understanding of others. During high school, I also knew gay students, they were all in the 'popular' groups, and one was named our valedictorian. While this is not necessarily indicative of how these students were feeling emotionally, I think it is a sign that the Catholic schools are accepting. Catholic schools promote understanding, social responsibility, and bring students to a self-understanding, so, I don't necessarily think banning the GSA was the most evil (even though it would have been very nice to have). Although, the chair could have chosen better words to explain the decision.
LC, Goderich Ontario
01/07/11 9:05 PM EST
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How is this legal???
This is exactly why my brother contemplated suicide on several occasions before finally accepting his sexuality. It was not because he feared disapproval from his family, but because the Catholic school system we grew up in allowed him to believe gays would burn in hell for all eternity for their "choices."
Jennifer, Waterloo Ontario
01/07/11 9:12 PM EST
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Response
Like I said, from MY experience, NONE of my teachers or administrators EVER stated it was a CHOICE to be gay. I do not believe that it is a choice at ALL! I feel like that needed to be stated before more people attack. You did also read that other Catholic schools do have GSA's though, right? You can't blame the entire Catholic system. There is usually more than one facet that leads to things like that. Public schools also have gays that have struggles. And, I am sorry that your brother contemplated suicide. That is a horribly difficult thing to go through. No one should have to experience that.
LC, Goderich Ontario
01/07/11 9:22 PM EST
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Here's an idea...
What parents would send a LGBT student to a Catholic school? If you don't like their policies and mission statements, don't send your kids there. Publicly funded or not, parents/caregivers are basically VOTING for such schools to stay open & carry on this way every time a child/teen is enrolled. Why participate in any religion (sorry - "ORGANIZATION") if it doesn't entirely support your lifestyle? Sorry, but I can't understand why people feel the need to associate themselves with religion to feel spiritual. Send your kids into the public systems and enjoy the LGBT supports. Otherwise, suck it up & abide by Catholicism's ideals. http://www.teacherchic.ca
AC, saskatoon SK
01/07/11 9:29 PM EST
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I went to St Vincent's with LeMay's daughters
... both of whom had great difficulties with fitting in shall we say, so it is very ironic she would make this comments. Alice Anne you and LeAnne know what I am talking about!
Sarah, From Oakville Ontario
01/07/11 9:59 PM EST
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Constitution Act of 1867
In order to stop the out-dated public funding of Catholic schools in Ontario (Separate Schools), Canada's constitution would have to be formally amended. The amending process would take years, require the support of all levels of government and the electorate, and more than a few lawyers. Nobody wants to go down that road for the reasons I just listed, not to mention the ugly culture war that it would unleash. However modern we like to fashion Canada, we're still a country very much tied to its past. Ontario used to be a very 'Orange' province, with a Catholic minority that rightly deserved certain protections. Catholic schools lawfully deserved equal funding as Protestant schools. But there are no Protestant schools anymore, so a 19th century compromise has become a 21st century conundrum. It's harder to fix than it needs to be because of our history. We learned that during the Mark Hall case, when the lawyers hired by the school board only had to point to the consitution to defend their disciminatory policies. Charter rights may be violated, but it's allowed by the constitution - how's that for a contradiction? I believe our constitution should be amended to restrict ALL forms of public money to religious institutions (hospitals exempt). Sadly I can't see anyone with influence willing to take up that fight.
Ryan, Toronto ON
01/07/11 10:03 PM EST
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Embarassing
I went to school in the halton area, never attended a catholic school for reasons like this. this is disgusting, and embarassing. No one has the right to decide what love it, or who is and is not allowed to love one another. i am actually ashamed to live in milton right now, i really hope this women gets severe backlash for her moral incompetance.
Rebecca DIas, Milton Ontario
01/07/11 11:01 PM EST
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hatred hiding behind theology
According to the Catholic church the sin is in having sex with a member of the same sex, that's pretty much what the bible says as well. There is no sin in being attracted to members of the same sex. Since GSAs are not sex clubs I fail to see how allowing GSAs would violate any Catholic teaching. This sort of thing is just a way to justify hatred and bigotry using religion. Even the Jesus of the bible associated with prostitutes and tax collectors, they were considered the lowest of the low at the time the bible was written yet Jesus put aside societal custom in associating with such people. Surely if this was an argument based on religion alone and not bigotry then GSAs would be encouraged as taking after Jesus's own actions. Keep in mind that according to Catholic teaching simply being gay isn't supposed to be a sin, there simply is no justifiable religious reason for a Catholic church to ban GSAs. There's also no religious justification either for the Catholic church being against many other aspects of the provincial curriculum except to appease the social conservatives amongst them. In fact when I was growing up what is known as social conservatism today was seen as very un-Catholic by a large faction of Catholicism who practiced and preached liberation theology, that is theology based on the liberation of human beings, the liberation theology movement was stamped out by the current pope in his role back then as the protector of the doctrine or some such title that he held back then. In those days of liberation theology, good Catholics voted NDP and were quite progressive, at least in the churches I knew. Since then the Catholic church has embraced right wing politics and in many cases it was their politics that has determined Catholic organizations' policies and not their actual theological beliefs. If it was okay for Jesus to associate with "undesirables" surely its okay for his followers to follow in his foot
Rich, Toronto Ontario
01/07/11 11:01 PM EST
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No accountability
The Ontario Government has spent $50,000,000 yep you read that right! The money was spent on an anti-bullying PR program that has done nothing to stop the school yard bullies. How do we know that! Parent groups are before the court suing! Two children would rather be dead then attend school. The lack of accountability is crazy. Please if you care about children please join the group of parents dedicated to having a third party investigation of these outrageous activities that are being ignored with lip service and cover up. Please, please help the private members bill to allow the Ombudsman to investigate not only the hundreds of thousands of dollars stolen by school administrators but the brutal attacks on children that are ignored by school officials and covered in paper work. If you think one school board official or Trustee will change the world you are as sick as the politicians that allow it to go on year after year. Facebook Ombudsman for Ontario Schools
Charlie, Toronto Ontario
01/07/11 11:14 PM EST
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defund them
If Catholic school boards refuse to follow provincial education policy and curriculum, this GSA issue is but one example of where they're refusing to follow provincial guidelines then they should have their funding taken away. I understand that according to the constitution we have to fund them but that doesn't mean they don't have to follow provincial guidelines and that some funding can't be with held based on the number of guidelines they refuse to follow, say for example that they refuse to follow the province's sex ed program which represents, say 1 out of 10 courses the students take (I don't know the actual numbers but for sake argument say its 10 courses) then they should be docked 10% of the funding they otherwise would have got. Our tax money shouldn't be going to teach catholic children that gays and lesbians are sick, evil and hell bound. if they want to teach that let them fund it themselves. They used to, the province used to only offer partial funding for Catholic high schools, so church donations and tuitions made up the rest. There was much resistance to accepting full funding back then because some realized it would mean that they would now have to follow provincial guidelines more closely. Some schools refused the full funding and remain to this day catholic high schools where tuition is paid. but now I guess some in the Catholic system figure they can take the province's money while ignoring provincial standards. They shouldn't be able to get away with it, yet they do. Its long past time that whatever needs to be done gets done to end full funding of catholic schools. Quebec has done it, why can't Ontario?
Rich, Toronto Ontario
01/07/11 11:15 PM EST
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wow
In response to the earlier comment about not sending your children there,I went to catholic elementary and high school and most parents who send their kids to such schools are not thinking of whether their children will be able to be in a GSA. Many lbgt kids in catholic families are not out to there parents and a GSA is a sign and place of safety and potential. Also if there is a protest I would love to go. Or someone should organize one. Because this is just bigotry and homophobia and kids who are already suffering enough will lose one of the few places of safety they have.
Reagan, Crystal Beach ON
01/08/11 12:49 AM EST
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AHA! A Workaround!
When I taught for Peel, I ran AHA!, the Anti-Homophia Association. It was a gay-straight alliance (I had most of our school's senior football team show up en masse for the first meeting, and there were no taunts of them by anyone.) Halton is clearly wrong, but that need not stop progress.
Uhclem, Toronto ON
01/08/11 7:14 AM EST
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Send complaints to Michael Paulter
I sent a letter yesterday to Michael Paulter, criticizing the ban, but also condemning LeMay's comments and calling for an apology at the very least, if not her resignation. I cc'd the Ontario Minister of Education and the Opinions Editor at the Hamilton Spectator. There hasn't been a single mention of this outside of the queer press. This woman's reckless speech needs exposure -- I encourage you all to do the same. Contacts at http://www.hcdsb.org/Board/Pages/Contact-Information.aspx.
VS, Toronto ON
01/08/11 9:10 AM EST
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shameful
You and your kind are an embarrassment to all Canadians. Why is it that hatred and discrimination is tolerated in Canada as long as it comes from a religious group?
Rev Rick White, Toronto Ont
01/08/11 9:44 AM EST
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To Alice Anne LeMay
I think you will end up reading this article, and the comments that follow it, Alice. I think there might even be a chance you will read my comment. I'd like you to ask yourself something. In your reading of the bible, did you gain an impression of Jesus Christ as a particularly judgmental fellow? Would he have acted as you are acting, or would he have loved his neighbour unconditionally? Because that in essence, is what this Jesus fellow taught. If you want to call yourself a Christian, you should probably do a better job of emulating your teacher. Who, by the by, never uttered a word in the entirety of scripture condemning gays... in any way. You really should stop paying attention to the old testament. Christ, after all, was the new covenant with man, and all he wanted to do is for folks like you to stop being mean to each other. Ask yourself - if Christ came to your office tomorrow, would he approve?
Tom Czerniawski, Mississauga Ontario
01/08/11 9:46 AM EST
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Not representative
I've gone through several Catholic schools in the Halton and Toronto districts. The students and teachers I'd say, in 99% of the cases are very inclusive. Most do not share the official church stance on being gay or gay marriage. This is true for most weird church stances..like condoms. This is really a matter of the 'leaders' being behind the times.
Alicia Marks, Oakville ON
01/08/11 10:15 AM EST
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This is a test for gay Conservatives
This is a test for gay Conservatives. Paul Marai is/was a director of the Progressive Conservative provincial riding association in Toronto Centre. See http://torontocentrepc.ca/about/. Gay Liberal MPP Glen Murray and lesbian Liberal MPP Kathleen Wynne have so far been silent on this issue (even though they are provincial cabinet ministers who could put pressure on the education minister to intervene). But, Marai can't be since he is now on the actual board. He needs to now deliver. He needs to get the board to reverse its decision or at least make it publicly known that he is firmly on the side of gay-straight alliances.
Rob, Toronto Ontario
01/08/11 10:18 AM EST
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Apples & Oranges
For board chair Lemay to make a remark that they do not allow Nazi groups either is missing the entire point. GSAs are set up to encourage understanding and learning, and to confront the kind of ignorance that leads to bullying. The Nazis and other fascists deliberately encourage ignorance, bigotry and power of the strong over the weak. GSAs work for human rights and equality. Fascists oppose human rights protection and equality. She is comparing apples and oranges. In fact, her statement is more in line with Nazi ideology than she understands. To Paul Marai: Good luck! Your presence on that board is a breath of fresh air.
Wayne, Edmonton Alberta
01/08/11 10:44 AM EST
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Disgusting.
Reading this made me so mad I am literally shaking with anger. I may not know all these facts and excellent points that my fellow commenters have pointed out, but I do know this. I went to a Catholic school in Halton and was bullied and tormented for being a lesbian. It got to the point that I was being attacked and was afraid to go to school. When approaching a Teacher she simply said "We don't approve Homosexuality here, so you can act normal or you can go". For the last two years of High School I finally transfered to a Public School and the Gay-Straight Alliance Group they had SAVED my life. I was accepted and felt like an EQUAL for ONCE in my life. Six years after High School, knowing there hasn't been ANY progress is upsetting, disgusting and ignorant. No child, gay or straight, should ever have to endure this torment. Every person, no matter what their religion should have a safe spot in which they can feel better, and at ease. Alice Anne Lemay, I honestly hope you can sleep at night knowing your ignorant and disgusting views are ruining and potentially killing people. You sicken me to my very core. You need to wake up and realise your views ARE NOT how everyone else feels, and you are now labeled to MANY candians as a horrible horrible woman.
Elizabeth, Burlington Ontario
01/08/11 11:26 AM EST
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Mistaken, NOT Catholic
As a retired Religious Education Department Head in Toronto I am angered to read that Ms LeMay's (et al)decision against GSAs in the Halton Catholic Board is based on Catholic teaching. It is NOT Catholic teaching to forbid students from gathering to talk about their lives and safety issues. This type of hurtful prejudice in the Halton Catholic Board must be confronted and opposed. I'm Gay and Catholic and shocked and angry over Halton's blindness. They must overturn this wrong policy! Barry Blackburn
Barry Blackburn, Toronto Ontario
01/08/11 11:31 AM EST
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Unbelievable
I graduated from a Halton Catholic high school a few years ago. My high school was absolutely PLAGUED with suicides. In my last few years at the school, and the two that followed, there were 5 or 6 student suicides. As a 15 year-old I had to walk in to my history class one day to discover that the boy who sat next to me had taken his own life the day before. Alice Anne LeMay is perpetuating intolerance, bigotry, and hate, when she should be expressing compassion and acceptance of the students in her board. I hope she is aware of how much blood she has on her hands. I remain a practicing Catholic, but this entire situation absolutely sickens me. If LeMay was actually familiar with Catholic teachings, she would be aware that the Catechism teaches tolerance and acceptance of homosexuals, even if their sexual practices are not condoned by the church.
Scott, Oakville Ontario
01/08/11 12:13 PM EST
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The kids need to write to local media.
My name's Sean, and xtra wrote an article about my school's struggle to have a GSA implemented when I was in high school. http://www.xtra.ca/public/Toronto/Principal_blocks_students_gay_group-2592.aspx Someone who is in touch with these kids, PLEASE tell them to write to their local media and file a complaint with the Ontario Human Rights Commission, as Jeremy Dias and myself (different times) did. In Dias' case, they ruled in his favour. In my case, it didn't even go that far. Once precedent has been set, these bigots literally shit themselves. USE IT TO YOUR ADVANTAGE! I hurts me to see injustice prevail in this world, and someone needs to make these bigots pay for the sadness they bestow upon this Earth.
Sean, Richmond Hill Ontario
01/08/11 12:18 PM EST
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sounds right
damn straight last time i checked its a catholic school board catholic means following the teachings of the bible. no where in the bible does it say anything about having gay groups have one out of school if its so important to you
vic, mississauga ontario
01/08/11 12:45 PM EST
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Relax People
Once again the media has decided to vilify Catholics, and I am disgusted at so many of these anti-Catholic comments I'm reading. The HCDSB is not discriminating against gays, as a matter of fact it does not tolerate any kind of harrassment or discrimination against anybody. The HCDSB is not saying that gays are not allowed in it's schools. As a matter of fact there are gay people who work within the board, and they are not treated any differently than anybody else. It is simply stating that gay activist groups cannot be permited within the school system because it's contrary to the teachings of the Church. If it did not adhere to the Catholic teaching it would not be a Catholic Board. The Catholic church recognizes that people are born gay and they can't help it. Nobody is condeming them. The Church only condems homosexual ACTIVITY because it is stated in the Bible that this kind of activity is a sin. Two people of the same sex cannot reproduce and thus were not made for each other in a sexual way because gay sex is not life producing. Thats all the Church says. The Catholic church has never bashed individuals for being born gay. People need to learn their facts before condeming Catholics. Catholics do a lot of good for the world through charitble work. I've never heard of any charities or hospitals that were funded by an athiest group, nor do you ever hear of any acts of heroism or selflessnes done by anit-Christians. I'm also disgusted by how the anti-Catholics think that it's OK to bash Catholics but it's FORBIDEN to bash any other religion or groups So before jumping on this band waggon that hates Catholics, look at your own life and see where Athiesm has gotten you. Don't be surprised if you don't like what you see.
Daniel, Oakville Ontario
01/08/11 3:17 PM EST
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Catholic means following the Bible?
Vic, you walk on shaky ground when you say Catholic means following the teachings of the Bible. Many Catholic beliefs, doctrines, teachings, saints, rituals and offices aren't even mentioned in the Bible. So give the gay students a break and let them have their GSA.
John, Toronto Ontario
01/08/11 3:27 PM EST
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@Daniel
Let's be clear about who slung the first mudpie here, Daniel: it wasn't queers that compared Catholics to a despotic hate-group; it was LeMay that equated queers with Nazis. But I imagine you will find some piece of doctrine to justify her approach.
VS, Toronto ON
01/08/11 3:32 PM EST
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wake up people
As a catholic, and as a citizen who's tax dollars go to the HCSB and as the parent of two Halton teens, I am disgusted that the board would even consider taking such a stance. It's our duty in a free society to provide rights, protection and support to ALL citizens regardless of sexual orientation. The simple fact that gay teens are at higher risk of suicide should be incentive enough to push the board into doing everything within it's power to provide support. I stand in support with those parents in Halton that may have gay teens, and I've taught my children that sexual orientation isn't a choice, it's luck of the draw at birth. Wake up Halton! Reflect the views of your constituents...in case you hadn't realized it, the year is now 2011...isn't it time for enlightenment.
Elizabeth, Oakville ON
01/08/11 5:03 PM EST
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re: relax people
Daniel please point out to us where in the bible is it forbidden for people who may one day sin to talk to each other and seek to make their lives a little better? You yourself point out that the Catholic church views the sin as being in the sex and not in the sexual orientation. Since GSAs are not sex clubs how is it following Catholic teaching to ban them? No this is nothing but hatred and bigotry hiding behind religion. Remember even Jesus from the bible associated with society's outcasts. The Catholic church should be using Jesus's example and not only allow but encourage GSAs to flourish in their school system. Besides why should one sort of potential sinner, gays and lesbians, be any different than any other potential sinners? The condemnation of same sex activity in the bible is no stronger than the condemnation of any other sin after all yet we are constantly reminded in the Catholic church that we are all sinners, that in fact we are even born in a state of sin. So why should this sin be treated any different than any other sin by the Catholic establishment if it weren't hiding its bigotry and hatred for LGBT folks behind its religion? I was raised catholic and went to Catholic grade and high schools, I'm now an atheist but I have actually read the entire bible, studied parts of it and I know of what I speak and since Catholicism is a part of my life I have no reason not to criticize it. Most of us were raised in some Christian religion or other and most of us have suffered to some degree because of that, it most certainly within our rights to say what we will about the institutions that have had such an impact on our lives. The reason very few criticize religions other than Christianity is because we have no experience of those religions and they haven't impacted on our lives the same way, that's changing of course as more people immigrate here with differing religions but still the majority comes from a Christian background.
Rich, Toronto Ontario
01/08/11 5:08 PM EST
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I learned gay was ok at catholic school
MY catholic school was run by a monastery. All monks. Some teachers were not monks, but not many. Most of them were gay and while not being obvious about it they didn't exactly hide it. Openly gay students were NEVER picked on, and this was 1991. We were taught the old testament from an anthropological point of view because they believed we could handle it. They didn't believe teaching one thing to the seminary students and another to the prep school students. We were taught the Koran. We had a Buddhist temple ON campus (the only non Jesuit monastery to have one). We were also taught about Hinduism (and Zoroastrianism). Also we were taught evolution in biology class. The local PUBLIC high school wouldn't do that. The Catholicism I learned was lead by Pope John Paul, extremism and fundamentalism were bad, science teaches us about god's creation, evolution did not contradict the bible. Jews and Muslims had a legitimate covenant with god, human genetic engineering was a sin, but the issue of using stem cells was being carefully studied. Going to that school was a revelation. One could be religious without being a bigot, ignorant, and hateful. In the last decade it seems all that went away and I want to cry.
Sean, Dallas Texas
01/08/11 6:04 PM EST
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catholic schools???
I am not surprised catholic schools do not want to support gay community. They would rather support pedofiles, whom they let to work in their system and abuse our children! I think that catholic schools is the past. There shouldn't be any catholic schools at all. We do not have jewish or muslim schools. Why do we still have catholic schools?
Adel, Thunder Bay ON
01/08/11 6:39 PM EST
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Embarrassed to be Canadian
I work for the Education system (public sector) and agree that she should be forced to tender her resignation. A Mayoral candidate in Ajax made a similar comment stating "if we fly the Pride flag we should also fly the Nazi flag.". She lost! If these misinformed Catholics want to continue to teach hate the Minister of Education needs to stop being such a coward and take a stand. Stop funding boards that teach hate.
Barry Bedford, Whitby Ontario
01/08/11 6:42 PM EST
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Antidiscrimination laws
Does Canadian and/or Ontarian antidiscrimination law extend to educational institutions? The NZ Human Rights Act was recently used to fine a fundamentalist school in which a gay netball coach inadvertantly found himself for unfair dismissal...
Craig Young, Wellington New Zealand
01/08/11 8:30 PM EST
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Seriously
Homosexuality support, teachings, have NO place in the Catholic School Board. This goes against the teachings of their RELIGION. Sorry. Don't like it? Don't send your kids there. Kudos to HCDSB. Why is this a surprise to anybody??
Seriously, Btown Ontario
01/09/11 12:43 AM EST
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Just end taxpayer funding of Catholic schools
@Seriously - The Catholic school system in Ontario is funded by taxpayers (an unfair and discriminatory privilege that does not extend to other religions as a result of a historical constitutional provision in 1867). Any taxpayer-funded organization must be publicly accountable. If, in 2011, Catholic school boards don't want to respect the human rights of gay students, then Ontario should do want Newfoundland did after the Mount Cashel child sex abuse scandal and de-fund Catholic schools. All it takes is a constitutionsl amendment to be passed by the Ontario Legislature and the Federal Parliament (the consent of the other provinces is not required).
Alex, Toronto Ontario
01/09/11 2:01 AM EST
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re Charter Rights etc.
People who choose, and I wish to emphasize that word: 'choose', to be Catholic are respected in Canada. We do not prevent Catholics from forming groups etc. or practicing their faith. I might abhor some of the beliefs of Catholics in regards to such inadvertent ignorance, and at times hate, but I don't want to be a bigot towards Catholics either. Students don't 'choose' what school they go to-- generally their parents do, and an educational institution is not a reflection of the personal religious belief of all of their students. I went to Catholic school and I was gay. I didn't choose to loose family members over this issue, nor did I choose to be in Catholic school. I also didn't choose the Catholic faith in my own personal life. We live in a secular country, yet we fund Catholic schools above all others in the Province of Ontario. Ontario is a unique Province in this regard, as other provinces have different systems. Changing this system seems to be political suicide in Ontario, but we must ensure that the Charter of Rights protections extends to those students who neither chose, nor possibly wish to practice the Catholic faith, yet are attending these schools due to their families decisions. Anne Lemay's comments are indicative of these rule makers glaring lack of regard for anyone outside of their own belief system regardless of their existence, and regardless of their legal responsibility to consider ALL students in their schools. It is imperative that we put policy in practice in regards to the Charter of Rights in any religious school.
Charter of Rights, Canada Ontario
01/09/11 7:51 AM EST
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God and ABC's dont mix
Its high time the Ministry of Education figured out that the Catholic Board is never going to follow the rules like the rest of the world, it breaks the law continuously and hides behind the Cross. Hopefully comments from bigots like her will speed up the removal of god from the classroom sooner rather than later. THIS IS AN ELECTION YEAR AND TWO SCHOOL BOARDS ARE VERY COSTLY. I like many people, am tired of being taxed to death and funding this bigotry should be stopped! If you want your kids to learn about your religion, get your ass out of bed on Sunday and take them to church and stop expecting my tax dollars to be used to teach your beliefs.
Terry, Brantford Ontario
01/09/11 1:46 PM EST
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Seperate School Board is not the Catholic Church
The Catholic separate school boards are not the Catholic church. The Church does not condemn homosexuals, but, right or wrong, the act of homosexual sex. The school board is wrong in its interpretation on Catholic teachings, and should take a closer look at the church's social teachings, the first principal of which is the dignity of all persons, including homosexuals. The decision of this school board is unfortunate, and contrary to Church social teachings. As a Catholic theologue, I'll be writing the school board to request they reconsidered their decision.
Christopher Duncanson-Hales, Sudbury ON
01/09/11 3:42 PM EST
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AA LeMay: you've been FARKed
The lead to this article first appeared Saturday morning on FARK: tagged as 'asinine.' Now Mrs A A LeMay your ugly mug and hateful remarks have been viewed all over the English speaking world. How does it feel to be seen by millions as a complete moron?
c johnson, Lebanon Oregon
01/09/11 9:48 PM EST
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Disgusted
That Halton Catholic board should be embarrassed...the trustee should be ashamed. They have all contributed to the ongoing struggles these young people face. As a Catholic, who sends her children to Catholic schools, I am disgusted.
ml, london on
01/09/11 9:52 PM EST
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This is just sad.
It's easy to say "don't send your kids there if you have a problem..etc" but a huge point missing is half these parents/guardians don't know their kid is LGBT or being bullied. Regardless if you are gay or not, supportive or not, ANY person has the right to proper education without the fear of being bullied based on something THEY HAVE NO CONTROL OVER. Any time an ignorant Catholic woman who has power within a SCHOOL BOARD uses 'Homosexual' and 'Nazi' in the same sentance, you sure as hell better believe there is going to be outrage.
Lily, Burlington Ontario
01/09/11 10:18 PM EST
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Easy solution
The catholic board is free to make whatever decisions it wants when it decides to not take any public money. The fact that a school board that is exclusionary by it's very nature gets tax dollars still baffles me.
Brandon, Bobcaygeon Ontario
01/09/11 10:40 PM EST
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Foul!
If the Halton Catholic Board won't abide by the policies of the Province then they shouldn't get public funding. They shouldn't anyway - religious schools are not in the public interest. And using the Nazi arguement shows an inability to reason.
Alecta, Toronto ontario
01/09/11 11:19 PM EST
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@Rich
Rich, you're right the Bible does not condem homosesuality any stronger than it does any other sin, which is why Catholic schools would not allow any group that condons sin, thus the reason why LeMay said she won't allow Nazi groups either. She's not comparing gays to Nazis, she's just making a point.
Daniel, Oakville Ontario
01/09/11 11:46 PM EST
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A message to the Anti-Catholics
WOW, you Athiests sure jump on every opportunity you get to attack Catholics. Good for the school board to not allow itself to be infiltrateded with garbage that only wants to corrupt it. And I want to point out that all you anti-Catholics are only against Catholic teaching because you people are evil. If everybody was Catholic there would be no killing, stealing, violence or injustice, so why are you against it...because YOU'RE EVIL!!You're the kind of people who lie, cheat, steal, use illegal drugs, get drunk in front you your kids, and some of you even kill. That's why you want to make the Catholic church out to be bad...you're trying to make yourselves look like you're the "normal" ones. You Athiests/Anti-Catholics are scum. You suck! Your lives suck. You're fat, bald, ugly, you men are cowardly and corrupt, and you women are no better than the whores on the street. You cheat on your spuoses and then you wonder why your kids grou up to be losers just like you. I'm sick and tired of the scum being the ones with the loudest voice and thinking they can corrupt everybody else. It's time that somebody speaks the truth. Brian
Brian, Cincinatti Ohio
01/10/11 12:01 AM EST
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@Daniel
The board could have easily said "pro-choice" or "comprehensive sex ed" instead of Nazi. The fact that they chose such a negative word implies their real motivation and real feelings about gays. Students, especially gay students, do not need to be hearing their school board members compare gays to one of the most horrific groups in the past century. It was absolutely irresponsible of them to use that term.
Caitlin, Dallas Texas
01/10/11 12:04 AM EST
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Supporting gay-straight alliances.
Well, first of all - this is a said 'Catholic' school with pre-established beliefs about not accepting homosexuality. So for someone to enroll in that school - it's something I would have seen coming already. But I fully support people who join gay-straight alliances because in those groups people of all orientations are able to coexist in peace. I mean, come on! This isn't a Satanist Lovers Club or anything. An exception should be made as we are in the year 2011 because whether their school officials agree with the students choices or not - it's not up to them in the long run. I'm from SOUTHERN TEXAS, where a naive person might assume people here are very against gay people, but it's not like that at all. Here's one straight girl supporting equal rights and freedom of speech (American as that might sound haha). Peace. ~S.
Sasha Henry, San Antonio, Texas, USA
01/10/11 12:39 AM EST
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Generalizations
Many people who comment on here & say they were once Catholics obviously didnt learn much about their Faith. Just because one person makes statements doesnt mean she speaks for every single living Catholic or Catholic school or church or people in existence. Your comments should be on point, not all over the place. Your hatred is showing as well!
Mandy, ontario canada
01/10/11 1:17 AM EST
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RE: a message to anti-catholics
i find your views on anti-catholics very amusing. clearly catholic raised, your views on the world are unfotunately jaded. you have just called every single person who does not support this act of hate and discrimination "evil,scum" as well as a cest pool of other unwarranted, uneducated claims. contrary to your belief, i am not a fat, old, balding man. surprisingly, i am a young, attractive woman who actually attended a catholic school for years of my life. despite my education, i have chosen to lead my own (athiest!) life rather then partake in an organization that promotes views i do not support. If you scroll up and down this thread, you are infact the only person who sounds like any of those discriptors you have provided above. and to be quite honest you sound like a total psychopath. "YOU'RE EVIL!!You're the kind of people who lie, cheat, steal, use illegal drugs, get drunk in front you your kids, and some of you even kill. That's why you want to make the Catholic church out to be bad...you're trying to make yourselves look like you're the "normal" ones. You Athiests/Anti-Catholics are scum. You suck! Your lives suck. You're fat, bald, ugly, you men are cowardly and corrupt, and you women are no better than the whores on the street. You cheat on your spuoses and then you wonder why your kids grou up to be losers just like you." WOW. just wow. the catholic church has clearly done you well. congratulations, you have just made me realise i AM the normal one. i'd love to continue making you look like an idiot but i think you have done a superb job on your own. also, i'd like to note how happy i am that my hard earned money is being wasted on raising people like you. you should be ashamed of yourself and your existance entirely. disgusted once again.
Rebecca Dias, Milton Ontario
01/10/11 9:50 AM EST
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It's still not okay
I'm from Hamitlon, and went to Catholic school, and I understand the church's position on same sex relationships, regardless, sexuality is not a choice, and these students deserve a place to discuss their lives, issues and feelings about what they are going through. High school is confusing enough, without knowing that you are NOT accepted by the school you attend and the religion you are being taught. Also, i'm aware that her statement is not reflective of every Catholic educator, but it doesn't make it any less upsetting and discouraging. We need to make changes people. and although it is years away and not and easy solution, if the Catholic School Board is not going to adapt with society, and conform to the rules the Ontario Education system have attempted to put in place, then the Catholic school board should NOT be publically funded.
MissV, st. Catharines ontario
01/10/11 10:06 AM EST
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Re: A message to the Anti-Catholics
If you are simply a troll, well played, sir. If, in fact, you believe any of the tripe you just spewed all over the internet then you are a sad, pathetic little creature. "If everybody was Catholic there would be no killing, stealing, violence or injustice" is possibly the most asinine statement in the history of the human race. The Church has been responsible for many of history's great evils from the Crusades, to the Spanish Inquisition. From Missionaries raping natives to Child-diddling priests. The Church has a very long history of killing, stealing, violence AND injustice.
Brandon, Bobcaygeon Ontario
01/10/11 10:50 AM EST
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different ideologies... accept it
There are different ideologies in the world and many of them conflict. The Catholic philosophy is without loopholes in their view of sexuality. Disagree with their opinions? Well, they're allowed to disagree with yours, right? If homosexuality is be accepted, then they must understand there will always be a difference in ideology. There is nothing wrong with that.
Lance, Everett WA
01/10/11 1:54 PM EST
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re: Daniel
You are wrong in that homosexuality is not a sin, homosexual sex is. Its quite likely than no one in the GSA has sinned in that way yet, probably dozens of times a day in thought but not in practice, for most of them anyways. My point was since everyone is a sinner and everyone will sin again why should this one group of potential sinners be singled out except out of bigotry and hatred for LGBT folks. Members of a GSA are just as likely to sin in the future as the members of the football team yet the football team isn't being banned. Keeping in mind that even Jesus associated with the social outcasts of his time their simply is no theological basis for banning GSAs in Catholic schools. There's nothing about allowing GSAs that would prevent them from teaching homosexual sex is a sin in their religion classes. Plus outside of religion class Catholic schools are supposed to be no different than the public schools. In addition there's also the issue of our Charter of Rights and Human Rights Code and where and when religious rights trump other rights and when they do not. That's also a big issue I haven't even touched on and won't except to say the school board would most certainly lose if a student took them to court over this issue.
Rich, Toronto Ontario
01/10/11 3:04 PM EST
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I think some of you guys need to calm down...
Last I checked, it's a religious school and they're within their rights to ban Gay clubs/groups/etc.. if the kid doesn't like it they can change schools. Look, the Bible is clear on the issue of homosexuality being a sin, and while Christians can't enforce this opinion on secular society, the reverse is also true. Just because people think banning these clubs is wrong doesn't mean they can enforce their morals on a Catholic school, especially when the rules aren't really affecting anyone. Gay kids can still hang out and interact with each other, and probably even have gay sex with each other in their own private lives. They just can't get any gay clubs condoned and sanctioned by the school. Also, I'm shocked at the outrage over the harmless comment regarding Nazis. At NO point did anyone compare Nazism to homosexuality, except that both are frowned upon by Catholics. This is just an example of media twisting words into something ugly, so they can have something to be angry about.
Chris B., Avalon Space
01/10/11 5:37 PM EST
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I agree with Chris B.
Way too much intolerance going on here. Its hipocritical in a way... the Catholics are intolerant because of there religion, and in turn we be intolerant of their intolerance? Thats not what we should do. They are intitled to their beliefs as long as they dont hurt others
Joey, Toronto Ontario
01/10/11 5:53 PM EST
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Leviticus bs
The evil writings in Leviticus 18:22 … against gays – depicts: “P” … “priestly rules” & expanded by the pope; homophobes and religious frauds … to attack the gay community and never meant to apply to the public -- but to priests. Leviticus exists in the old testament & torah … & was written long after Moses -- 600BC. How would you like it … if hate speech was directed to your brother or sister as you sat in the pew; spewed by some better than thou religious lunatic with a hateful black book about Leviticus -- under his arm? The pope and churches fully aware that Leviticus 18:22 applies only to priests refuse to remove this stigma maliciously persecuting gays. Kids bullied into suicide …! Being black or left-handed or being gay is just as natural. If the black community or women had it written that they should be put to death; how would they like that? Churches are committing hate crimes and more succinctly a violent criminal offence against a federally protected minority namely the gay community. It is actually a bigger moment in history … gays standing up for equality … soldiers being discharged are indeed exposing something far greater ... the realization that there is something far more evil at work -- hateful religion which should be discharged from society -- period. United States is supposedly fighting for democracy but within the U.S. they treat gays like secondary citizens. It’s now time to shut down the churches & synagogues with bibles with leviticus 18:22. Religion and the churches should now be exposed as a bigoted structure that gets away with hate mongering. It is a criminal offence to cause harm onto others physically or with written items … bibles have been getting away with this for ages. Tony Perkins and his The Family Research Council's opposition to gay rights have landed the outfit onto a list of "hate groups,” like the KKK. Christian colleges should be classified as hate groups and shut down. UK P
MACDONALDBANK, Toronto ON
01/10/11 8:04 PM EST
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I disagree with Chrs B.
A few points you're both missing. 1. Secular society is not telling the [secular-funded] Catholic school board to change its religion, or its position on homosexuality. They can continue to oppose the sin of homosexual acts all they like. A Gay-Straight-Alliance is not a sin even according to the Church's definition. 2. Students are don't choose to be gay and nor do they choose what school they go to. Telling them if they don't like their school they can leave isn't exactly how it works. 3. The Nazi comment was not harmless. If somebody disagreed with you and then said "Well I don't support Nazis either.." - how would you take it? The classic argument against gay marriage goes like this 'What's next Beastiality!?!' You cannot deny they are making an association. They are evoking an image/word/memory/symbol that we inherently despise and assigning the same feeling to whatever you are talking about. If you have to use the word Nazi to defend your point in the first place, you better be talking about a terrorist club or something. Everybody knows a GSA is pretty innocent, it's teenagers meeting in a safe supervised environment and talking to eachother. If it was a Knitting Club I doubt anybody would feel the need to bring up Nazis.
Ryan, Toronto ON
01/10/11 8:13 PM EST
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for SHAME
Has it not become blatently CLEAR that our LBGT youth need support to be readily available to them where they indeed spend the majority of their time. Highschool is yes, a place of education...but is it not also a place where personal growth should blossom, and be encouraged?! Basically, you deny a student their right to an alliance, and you deny their right to safety. You deny their safety...and what use is the education when the mind is clogged with fear and insecurity.
Cailie, Whitby ontario
01/10/11 8:28 PM EST
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re: I agree with Chris B.
Joey you say "They are intitled to their beliefs as long as they dont hurt others" but by denying LGBT students a safe space on campus they are hurting others, LGBT students are at a much higher risk for suicide and anti-gay bullying and violence. By denying these at risk students a safe space they are contributing to the increased risks for LGBT students. Besides which there is no theological basis for denying GSAs at Catholic schools since it is the sex act that is the sin according to the Catholic church and not the gay or lesbian person themselves, even the Catholic church recognizes that being gay or lesbian is not a sin in itself, which puts it miles ahead of some other Christian sects that do view simply being gay/lesbian as a sin in and of itself. Promoting LGBT folks as equals in society is in no way contrary to Catholic teachings, though they do expect LGBT people to remain celibate their entire lives and never have sex with someone of the same sex. Too often what happens though and is clearly happening in this case is that the sin of same sex sexual activity is used as cover for bigotry and hatred of LGBT students. Keep in mind homosexuality itself is not a sin or against the teachings of the Catholic church, only homosexual sex. Their condemnation of homosexual sex should be confined to their religion classes and not used as justification for hatred and bigotry against LGBT students by denying them a safe space on campus. I grew up in the Catholic church and attended Catholic schools all the way through, I am familiar with Catholic teachings on the matter of homosexuality and know what I am talking about.
Rich, Toronto Ontario
01/10/11 8:51 PM EST
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Alice Lemay-you are my new personal hero
FINALLY a trustee with a spine. Alice Lemay-hang in there...you're doing an excellent job. You little Hitchens groupies need to buy a clue. A TRUSTee is someone we Catholics elect who has our TRUST to uphold the Teaching Authority of the Church. I work in a High School with a newly formed GSA and I can assure you that for Christians, these groups are the epitome of intolerance. Our workplace USED to be an egalitarian mix where staff conversations were free and easy. Now, the climate of fear is palpable for the 3 or 4 staff who are practicing Christians. If we so much as mention our faith within earshot of the coordinators of this hateful group, we're branded extremists, intolerant or just shouted down in conversation. We are the oppressed now and there are a lot more Christians here than same-sex attracted/confused students. I can perfectly well see an apt analogy between GSA groups and National Socialist thugs at their little rallies in the 1930s. The bottom line is this: "queer" ideology, "gender theory" and the very notion that for some of us, despite our obvious heterosexual physiology, it is "normal and natural" that we turn our back on reality and self select evolutionary extinction is absurdity and folly. The Catholic Church as it is founded by Jesus Christ, is THE light of the world and all along she has been right in her teaching of the nature of man and marriage and family.
Jolene Cassa, Toronto ontario
01/10/11 9:05 PM EST
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Alice Lemay-you are my new personal hero
Alice Lemay-hang in there...you're doing an excellent job. You little Hitchens groupies need to buy a clue. A TRUSTee is someone we Catholics elect who has our TRUST to uphold the Teaching Authority of the Church. I work in a High School with a newly formed GSA and I can assure you that for Christians, these groups are the epitome of intolerance. Our workplace USED to be an egalitarian mix where staff conversations were free and easy. Now, the climate of fear is palpable for the 3 or 4 staff who are practicing Christians. If we so much as mention our faith within earshot of the coordinators of this hateful group, we're branded extremists, intolerant or just shouted down in conversation. We are the oppressed now and there are a lot more Christians here than same-sex attracted/confused students. I can perfectly well see an apt analogy between GSA groups and National Socialist thugs at their little rallies in the 1930s. The bottom line is this: "queer" ideology, "gender theory" and the very notion that for some of us, despite our obvious heterosexual physiology, it is "normal and natural" that we turn our back on reality and self select evolutionary extinction is absurdity and folly. The Catholic Church as it is founded by Jesus Christ, is THE light of the world and all along she has been right in her teaching of the nature of man and marriage and family.
Jolene Cassa, Toronto Ontario
01/10/11 9:08 PM EST
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@Rich
OK, now you're making rediculous arguments. Yes football players may commit sins (they are not perfect) but the sport of Football is not a sinsful game, thus you can't say we should bann football just like we ban a gay club. If somebody wanted to start a Marijuan club that would be banned also because drugs are sinful. Football is not. See the difference? And yes Jesus did associate with outcasts so that he can talk to them and inspire them to change for the better. He didn't start up clubs that celebrate or glorify sinful acts. Just as in Catholic schools, the school fosters an environment that is safe and welcoming for all. Any type of discrimination and harrassment is not allowed in Catholic school. The gay issue can be addressed without bringing in a club. I don't know why you people think that this club is the one magical thing that will solve all the world's problems. Wake up, splash some cold water on your face, and really think about what you're getting all angry over.
Daniel, Oakville Ontario
01/10/11 11:36 PM EST
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@Rebecca and Brandon
Rebecca so you decided to stop being Catholic. I guesse the whores you hung out with in that broken down junkie town of Milton, were more influential on you than your teachers. You're an example of what I'm talking about you disgrace. I'm sure your fat, bald, tattooed, alcoholic, piece of shit boyfriend is proud of you. By the way I'm sure that right now he's getting a blow job from the toothless woman in the trailor while you read this......Brandon don't beleive everything you read in the papers.
Brian, Cincinatti Ohio
01/10/11 11:51 PM EST
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From the National Post........
The Assembly of Catholic Bishops of Ontario sent a letter to all Catholic school boards suggesting that the ministry-proposed gay-straight alliance groups might be too premature for high school students, and that alternative forms of support should be offered to promote healthy relationships. Trustee Anthony Danko suggested they listen to the bishops, Ms. LeMay said. The board voted eight to one in favour, with two abstaining. Members of the newly elected board have individually vowed to battle the ban, including Paul Marai, the board’s first openly gay trustee. The 22-year-old says he grew up in Halton Catholic schools and was never taught to sit idly by while another student was bullied for being gay. That said, telling students they can’t have a specific kind of group that addresses homophobia and gay rights sends a discordant message. Read more at: http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/Catholic+school+board+reconsider+straight+groups/4088419/story.html
Peter From, Toronto ON
01/11/11 1:49 AM EST
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re: Daniel
Daniel the ridiculousness of the ban was the whole point of that post. Gay and hetero students getting together to talk about homophobia and create a safe space for LGBT students also isn't sinful, just like a football game isn't sinful. Its true that at least the gay members of GSAs will most likely one day sin according to the Catholic church, but that's also true of football players. It is ridiculous for a Catholic school to claim they must ban GSAs because because of Catholic teaching when there is no basis in the church's theology for doing such a thing. Interesting that you seem to refuse to believe that being gay or lesbian isn't inherently sinful according to the Catholic church, don't take my word for it, look it up. I'm so tired of the we're not being bigots we're discriminating because of our religious beliefs argument because in reality it has nothing to do with their religious beliefs since that only covers sex and not equal rights or forming associations and its simply a way for some to try and hide their bigotry and hatred behind their religion, including priests, bishops and popes though certainly not all of them, some stick by their theology and don't let bigotry and hatred colour church teachings, but in this case they most certainly have. If you're not Catholic then just ask yourself what Jesus would do? if you're a believer anyways. The Jesus described in the bible most certainly would be on the side of the persecuted, in this case the LGBT students in Halton high schools. I've actually studied the new testament, read the entire bible too. The Jesus described was always on the side of the afflicted and the outcast, he also never had anything to say about gays or lesbians yet for many of his followers its one of the major issues facing Christianity today, how to oppose the advancement of gay and lesbian equality in our societies. If it were really an issue for God don't you think his son and messenger would have had something to say about it?
Rich, Toronto Ontario
01/11/11 3:02 AM EST
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WWJD?
We should ask ourselves one thing here: What would Jesus do? Christian or not, his message was one of love and acceptance, not hate. Don't forget the Golden Rule people! So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets. (NIV, Matthew 7:12)
Lee, Toronto Ontario
01/11/11 9:23 AM EST
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Paul Marai, Trustee, Supports Ending Ban on GSAs
Here's the link to Trustee Marai's website. http://www.paulmarai.com/gsa.html His statement is copied below: "The decision to ban Gay-Straight alliances was inappropriate and should be reversed. In all of this, no one is asking what is best for the students. Clearly, it is to feel accepted in their own school communities. I want to know why the past board was wasting time enacting this ban in the first place - wasting time dividing people when we can concentrate on actually improving the schools we represent. I would rather be talking about technology in the classroom and student success. I will push to have this issue brought up at the earliest opportunity of the board. So that I can speak strongly in favour of scrapping the ban."
Michael Went, Toronto Ontario
01/11/11 7:18 PM EST
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Grow up
School is the wrong forum for anything to do with Sexual Orientation..or should we have and I;m straight club? Maybe and I abstain from sex club? or how about I S&M club? catholics have their beliefs and can run their schools how they want. If you don't like it go to a public school. Should we go into other schools of different denominations and try to change their beliefs? GROW UP! Find something else to occupy your time with unfortunately children commit suicide, bully eachother, lie to their parents and kill eachother for MANY reasons..and they have been for many years. Yes, it's sad, yes, we as adults don't understand it but there are MEAN KIDS everywhere. BULLYING in general should be addressed and as far as I've heard, public and catholic schools are not doing a very good job of fixing it, they are brushing it under the rug in most cases. Why? FEAR! we as children used to fear people in authority, used to fear our parents - but today - kids rule. Let's start a group for Adults!
Rose, Toronto ON
01/11/11 9:11 PM EST
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apology
If anything, the lady should be apologizing to nazis for comparing them to gay people. The only thing worse then being a homosexual is having a transexual stand beside you.
Gay, People Go To Hell
01/11/11 11:35 PM EST
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I'd Always Wondered
I've always wondered what happened to the actress who played Molly(of Molly's Reach Restaurant) on the Beachcombers. Now I know.
CJ, Toronto ON
01/12/11 12:35 AM EST
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Good.
Well ... Homosexuality is against the teachings of the bible. If students feel strongly about starting a group that goes against what their high school is teaching them ... they know where the front doors are. If they want a group such as that to be a part of, there is plenty of Public schools they can go to.
Jay, Toronto ON
01/12/11 11:06 PM EST
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ridiculous
In highschool i was a part of these gay straight alliance groups and iam extremely discouraged to hear about this. It was a great way of showing schools different ways to protect against homophobia in the region, now this? why who is it really hurting? except for your students
Natasha Mandeville, milton ontario
01/12/11 11:38 PM EST
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One public secular school system for Ont
Two things: as a service supported by public money doesn't the Halton Catholic school board have to comply with the human rights act and the charter which includes a ban on discrimination based on sexual orientation? 2) the behaviour of the Halton Catholic school board is a good reason why we need to abolish the Catholic separate school board in Ontario and have only one school board in Ontario.
Mike Jan, Ottawa Ontario
01/13/11 12:37 AM EST
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question
With the comments directed toward the Roman Catholic church - if the Pope were gay - would that make these comments hate crimes?
sandi, windsor ontario
01/13/11 3:48 AM EST
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WTF grow up you old fucks who cant except anything
this is bullshit we are in 2011 now not the 1800's get with the times. PLUS isnt equality something we drill into the students heads/?? How is banning a specific group showing any example?? disgusting!! also way to make someone feel like CRAP about themself
Sarah, Milton Ontario
01/13/11 7:01 AM EST
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Trololol
Whats funnier than a dead baby? A dead baby in a blender.
Trollface, Trololol Trololol
01/13/11 9:56 AM EST
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What to ban?
If anything, they should ban Alice Ann LeMay's hairstyle! Good Lord, didn't the Bible proscribe such things? Additionally, I sense a certain gluttony in her bearing.
Keith G, New York New York
01/14/11 8:10 PM EST
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The Bible is not wrong, but...
I love these comments that talk about what the Bible teaches. We're not idiots. We know that the Bible is a vast diatribe that teaches... well, everything. You can use it to support probably any argument. So the savvy observer would want to look to the fundamental meanings of the Bible, without going all fundamentalist. It's a fine line. But here it is, what the Bible is really about. Are you ready? Here 'goes: Love God. Whatever that means to you. The Order of All Things. The Supreme Being. Love and appreciate that spirit or feeling or entity or concept. Love the fact that things came together in such a way for us to all be right here, right now. Love that, with everything you've got. You know, with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. Be thankful that things, amazing things, worked out somehow to get you here. Don't knock it. It's a Good Thing. Appreciate it. And love the people around you, as you love yourself. That means, first, you have to love yourself, which is hard for many. But try. Just don't put yourself and your needs above everyone else's. Love the people around you, as much as you love yourself. I'm talking about your friends and neighbors. Love thy neighbor as thyself. So that's it. That's what the Bible really says. All of the rest is supporting documentation. I'm sure that if you read it in this context, it will take on new meaning for you. You can read difficult passages (for us) like the ones about homosexuality being an abomination (I guess that's Leviticus 20:13) with the same "yeah, right" relevance as the passages (hmmm, also Leviticus!) describing the eating of things like lobster, shrimp, calamari, oysters, mussels - all of that good stuff - as an abomination. Just skip over those parts. You don't need them, to get the gist of what's in the Bible.
Keith G., New York New York
01/14/11 8:35 PM EST
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... chill and stop over reacting
Catholics believe that god created everything and all of the humans ability's So they think God created Hormones and Chromosomes and if he did then he made it possible to fall inlove with the same sex. If you say "no he didnt make us fall inlove with the same sex because thats a sin." Then your doubting how God is the Creator of everything. so if you think that then There is no Religion only science. I am 13 years old in grade 8 in Elementary school and when i heard of this in History Class (we were kinda off topic) I was Pissed! im not Gay but i sure do support them. My parents raised me to accept all and they told me when i was little "James, Don't Pick on Kids for being Gay because you dont know yet but you might turn out to be Gay" I Turned out strait But I know that some of my friends will maybe turn out Gay and they will still be my friends. I remember this year in class i asked why God Was against Gays and My teacher told me "Because People from the Same sex cant Produce babies so the earth cant re-populate." And i thought in my head that life was nothing except to work and Re- populate... You cant even love someone if there the same sex. Im sorry but when i was 5 and being raised as a catholic i didnt know i was gonna be the churches bitch and have to do everything that they say. I Believe the God and the Holy catholic church and the communion of Saints but i also support Gay people. Thats my Opinion and Im 13 and For Saying i Believe in Gay people I feel alot more mature than these stupid Inconsiderate God Addicts.
James, Georgetown Ontario
01/14/11 11:17 PM EST
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Tell Her not commenters!
Catholics are not "churches bitches". Prove me wrong that every religion asks it's people to improve upon their lives and take an active part in their faith. Catholic bashers are still living in the past, talking about the crusades, etc. by the way, sorry I noticed, but many of those pedophile priests admitted to being Gay. So I am assuming that there are alot of GBLT who dont condone pedophiles. Fact remains, many of them were Gay! quit living in the past, Humans are humans and every human makes mistakes. That doesnt mean that you can generalize about one particular religion. Thats immature bashing. If all of you feel this strongly, why dont you write her a letter so SHE can see it?? She's never going to read the comments here!!! A physical letter sent to her personally is what should have been done so that others didnt have to continue to be offended by this ignorance by BOTH sides!!!!
Mandy, ontario canada
01/15/11 4:58 PM EST
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Ok wtf are you kidding me
What ok let me get this right gays cant go to school because they like the same sex.... so! like what harm would having a gay person do! it's not like every gay person is going to go out and spread the "gay" people know what they like sexually and just because their is gay people don't mean they are gonna tear down the church.... gay people who go to these schools go because they want to learn about god and Jesus they agree with all that god stands for just they can't help it if they are attracted to the same sex ...if anything we should welcome gays because that shows that we understand that people don't have a choice when it comes to sexuality and that we don't care all people are created the same and have the rights to do as they wish as long as tho's two people love each other because thats what sex is no? strong love between two people and who are you to say otherwise ......im not gay but the only reason i'm Catholic is because i believe in god a god that loves all no matter what. but if that god dose not love someone because they are gay and wont let them have the same chances as heterosexual people then i dont want to believe in that god... that god sounds more like the devil ... not letting them go to school thats just wrong i understand if you think its wrong good for you great just let them go to school what will it do nothing i have never met a gay who acts diffrent from other people they get good grades have nice manners and treat others with respect so who here is the real abomination the gays or you...
Ryan, Greorge town Ontario
01/15/11 9:27 PM EST
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Common sense.
Catholics schools have the right and duty to promote Catholic values. Homosexuality is incompatible with Catholicism. Therefore, the school is correct to ban the gay-straight alliance. It is pretty simple to understand.
Frank, oakville ontario
01/16/11 11:43 PM EST
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U SUCK HOMOPHOBICS
this is so irrelevant
gaby carrera, california/montebello hi
01/17/11 1:56 AM EST
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Nazi's Not Allowed?
There is a a lot of irony here... Alice Ann LeMay comment is closer to a Nazi viewpoint than those that are accepting of Gay sexuality. And, those who are act in a loving and accepting way towards to the downtrodden and Gays is more in common with the teachings of Jesus than Alice Ann LeMay's interpretation of the Chatholic Church's teachings. She is entitled to her view, but she needs to be responsible at least in part of any Gay children in Halton School Boards that commit suicide.
Gary Hicks, Burlington Ontario
01/17/11 11:16 PM EST
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Tell Alice Directly
It's not homophobic to not want to promote an activist group. Activism sometimes incites violence. If the club is that important, they should go to public school. Just because of sexual preference there has to be a club? Then to be fair, there should be a promiscuous club, a haters club, a ho club, a teacher hater club, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc.... It would be more constructive & positive to have a club that does not center on sex all the time. GBLT just want to bend everyone's policies to get their way. Talk about intolerant.
Ashley, patinkin idaho
01/18/11 12:43 AM EST
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Irony
They wouldn't allow a neo-nazi group, but that being said the Church fully backed the nazi party during WWII. If anything, according to the papacy: nazis are okay, but gays are evil. Moderate Catholics should be rethinking about their upside-down, house of cards belief system right about now.
ADaPonte, Kitchener On
01/19/11 8:02 PM EST
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No Irony only Ignorance
Those who want their way will say & do anything to get it. They want everyone and everything to bend & allow their personal or sexual preferences. Bring up past events, scew them to fit their agenda & lie. Watch out if you don't agree with them! Like the Catholic bashing. ADaPonte, WHERE is your proof that the church backed the nazi party? Sounds like you yourself have a upside-down, house of cards, can't hold any water kind of belief system.
sherrah, Chicago Illinois
01/25/11 4:24 PM EST
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Unfair
I think it is ridiculous that the Catholic church gets lambasted everytime Gay and or lesbian comments are made.They are beacon of light and morality at a time when there is very little in this world. Being a proud Catholic, I can say that the church has done something not a lot of people can be associated with - sticking to their core values.
Church supporter, Burlingotn Ontario
01/26/11 5:21 PM EST
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The strategy
Since the early 1990s gay activists and various homosexual groups have been using strategies that provide them with greater access to public schools. Usually the focus is upon making the schools a safer place for homosexual, bisexual, transgender, and transsexual students, thereby justifying the introduction of topics and speakers on the subject of homosexuality. The establishment of homosexual clubs on campus provides an ongoing forum to promote and advance homosexuality to students on campus. For example, movie nights showcasing homosexual relationships; pro-homosexual day of silence events; same-sex handholding days; hosting pro-homosexual speaker events; and publishing pro-homosexual articles in school newspapers.
Vox Populi Z, Sydney Nova Scotia
03/18/11 5:10 PM EST
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