Wednesday, June 9, 2010 12:31 PM

total respect out to Mark T. He can swim in my pool anytime.

roy

Wednesday, June 9, 2010 1:21 PM

I'm glad to hear even more folks are taking a stand against censorship at Pride, Sandilands had claimed, without backing it up with any sort of evidence, that some groups were pulling out of Pride when they thought QuAIA was going to march. Well far more are going to be pulling out over their censorship of Pride, I wonder if Pride Inc thinks this is still just "the left howling". I hope the Bathhouse Raids and Pussy Palace panels still go ahead at some point though, I'd like to be able to attend.

Rich

Wednesday, June 9, 2010 1:52 PM

Sadly PT leadership are only interested in the support of "everybody who is anybody", not people with integrity and a conscience. Thank you Mark and Toronto Bathhouse Raids and Pussy Palace panels .

JG

Wednesday, June 9, 2010 3:24 PM

useful idiots

roflsauras

Wednesday, June 9, 2010 4:06 PM

Does anyone really care about the Israel/Palestine conflict, or even know the reality of it, or is everyone more concerned about bringing Pride Toronto down? Do some research before jumping on the bandwagon people. Israel is the most pro-LGBT state in the Middle East. Are we fighting for queer rights anymore, which has always been the fundamental roots of Pride worldwide, or are we mixing international politics unrelated to queer issues? Both are equally important, and both have a time and a place.

Chris

Wednesday, June 9, 2010 4:37 PM

Thank you Mark. I don't think some people appreciate how difficult and costly it is to speak out against a country who has constantly been dubbed as "the most pro-LGBT state in the Middle East". Helen Thomas, a famous journalist veteran, was recently forced to resign because of her comments on Israel. Queers everywhere should fight for those who are the most marginalized, even if they do not support our rights in return. This is what pride is about, not being afraid to speak up for those living in despair, even if there is a heavy personal price to pay, even if its unpopular to the corporate world, and the mainstream media. Pride is about being fearless. And Mark and many other activists who are against censorship have shown their fearlessness with their stance against Pride Toronto. I hope fearlessness wins out.

Mary

Wednesday, June 9, 2010 5:21 PM

Well said Chris. I have and will always support the fight for LGBT rights. This is not about free speech, it is about QuAIA trying to hi-jack the parade for their own political purposes. If Pride Toronto does reverse their stand of not allowing apartheid to be used on banners or signs in the parade I will not attend nor will most of my friends and family. QuAIA members time will be better spent marching on the US and Israeli consolates.

Don

Wednesday, June 9, 2010 5:58 PM

@ Chris and Don:
I, for one, am getting really tired of listening to the same lame old reasons why QuAIA should be banned. I don't care what your position is about Israel/Palestine; political speech is not hate speech and limiting political speech amounts to censorship.

Chris, whether or not Israel is the most pro-LGBT state in the middle east is neither here nor there and should not be used as an argument to shield them from criticism.

Don, QuAIA has never tried to "hijack" the parade. The first year that they marched in the parade they were a small contingent and went largely unnoticed. It was only in subsequent years, when people started complaining about them, that they started to get attention. And now that they are being censored, they are getting a ton of free press, getting their message out there, and people are beginning to realize that they are not the crazy hateful people that they are made out to be. So ironically, if you are concerned about QuAIA getting too much attention, the best thing you can do is to stop complaining about them, and stop trying to silence them, because those efforts are backfiring big time.

The LGBT community is a diverse community, and so the struggle for queer rights always has been and always will be connected with issues of race, class, religion, gender, free speech, and so on. I'm very sorry for both of you if you can't see the connection between human rights and queer rights, or if you can't see the ways in which our community has struggled historically and continues to struggle for free speech and free expression. I'm very sorry for you if this reality makes you uncomfortable. If you'd prefer to stay home, that's too bad, but that's your decision to make.

I, for one, applaud Mark Tewksbury for his courageous decision to stand up for the principles that have always stood at the heart of Pride.

David Frankovich

Wednesday, June 9, 2010 7:59 PM

David Frankovich,

I just want to say that your words written in the comment above are really powerful and exactly right.

The truth is QuAIA never got a great deal of attention, until there was this maladroit name-calling campaign against us. Now we are taking it to the national level. I dunno, maybe I should thank the Israel lobby for promoting our message? The only problem is it seems that they are perfectly willing to wreck Pride in order to get their way.

And I just want to emphasize that there is a growing grassroots queer movement in Palestine and the Arab world. The best thing to do for them is to let them lead the way... they understand their own situation much better than anyone in Canada reading these comments.

Sav.

Wednesday, June 9, 2010 9:10 PM

Its very true that all the oppositon to QuAIA has done far more to get their message to way way more people than they ever could have done on their own. I for one didn't actually remember QuAIA from last year's march, I believed the reports that there was a hate group marching during Pride, I had no reason to doubt them, however I wanted to see just how bad they were for myself imagining all sorts of nastiness and scandal but then I found out they weren't a hate group at all and were in fact a human rights group, they didn't strike me as anti-semitic in any way, I've seen and read anti-semitic comments on Israel before, they almost always blamed all Jews everywhere for the problems in Israel and their focus was solely on the Jewish angle, I saw none of that sort of anti-semitism from QuAIA. I felt pissed off about how I had been lied to and manipulated to believe that these folks were a hate group so I started to defend them and free speech whenever I saw comments spouting misinformation about them. I never would have known anything about QuAIA or the situation Palestinians live under in the occupied territories if it weren't for Gladstone and his ilk doing their best to silence QuAIA, well they may have got them censored but it really backfired on them if their goal was to silence them, they're now known around the world, their censorship is being reported in the LGBT media of many countries getting them all sorts of free advertising internationally too. However its not really about QuAIA, its about Pride Inc, well a majority of their board anyways having no spine and giving in to external pressure and censoring a queer group who only ever engaged in totally legal political speech and never hate speech, removing the right of free expression from one group in Pride is an attack on all of us since we all are affected, the right of free speech includes the right to hear speech and once the precedent of censorship has been established along with the board's willingness to allow outside forces to define what Pride is or is not about in place of the LGBT community whom its supposed to be about, well then that's a serious problem on its own merit regardless of who the target of the censorship was.

Rich

Wednesday, June 9, 2010 11:24 PM

Chris and Don-- This is not about QuAIA 'hijacking' the parade. They are not even allowed to march in the parade! This is about their RIGHT as members of the queer community to express their political views, regardless of whether they are popular with the Israeli or Canadian government of the day. I live in a democracy (I think) and one that is based on the principles of freedom of expression. Lift the ban NOW!

AK

Friday, June 11, 2010 2:28 PM

Free to Speak is very important. With regret I must inform you that to me Free Speak is like freedom to choose. We might not like what they have to say but if they are gay they are part of our community. I am sure that I say many many things that people do not like... and make many choices that people do not like... However... Banning me from an event... is the same as saying ... you are not one of us... Thomas Wall - London, Ontario

Thomas Wall